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Originator
n00b
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Joined: 31 Dec 2003
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2003 5:29 pm    Post subject: OffTheWall Reply with quote

I have taken a new name in order to not give away who I am. I guess reading the web logs & IPs would fix that.

OTW has become a stomping ground for people and their vices. The OTW forum has reached a critical mass where people are showing that they have lost all sense of respect and decency. Within 1 week we have had Lovechild & ebrostig claim they are leaving. The very openness and carefree attitude of the forums that has helping it thrive & florish has turned full circle and is now helping augment its destruction. I have seen this behavior happen on the anandtech.com forums way back in 1998. The mods & the administrators will need to come up with a plan and most of all to stick to it as this problem will continue to fester & grow.

Thanks,
A concerned Gentoo'er who has donated time & money and is now sad to see this happenning.
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shm
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Joined: 09 Dec 2002
Posts: 2380
Location: Atlanta, Universe

PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2003 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think two long term posters leaving (for somewhat unrealted reasons) is a reason for concern. That's perfectly normal.

Originator wrote:
The OTW forum has reached a critical mass where people are showing that they have lost all sense of respect and decency.


Yes, loss of respect is important.. I'm concerned with some of the namecalling and loss of respect some people have against other people.

OTW, however, is a place where posts are breeding grounds of where people who people of differing opinions can talk freely. Some people are going to consider certain things decent, and other people simply are not..

Thus, I suggest that mods make sure that threads are not filled with silly namecalling of other members. I haven't seen any other things that concern me however.
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Cerement
Guru
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Joined: 14 Jun 2003
Posts: 404

PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2003 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gentoo Forums wrote:
Off the Wall
Want to talk about something not related to Gentoo? Post it here.

Off the Wall is not where we go when we want support or useful information, there's 28 other forums for that.
Off the Wall is where we end up while waiting for emerge.
Off the Wall is where we end up while waiting for an answer to one of our posts in one of the other 28 forums.
Off the Wall is where we blow off steam instead of throwing our comp out the window after accidentally typing "rm -r / usr/portage/distfiles" (spot the space).
Off the Wall is where we go to rant after resisting the urge to post "RTFM" or "try search n00b" to the hundredth post asking how to install gentoo.
Off the Wall is curiousity and venting and arguments and rage and thought-provoking and puzzling and random and annoying and relieving all at the same time.
Off the Wall is not a support forum.

Yes, the namecalling can get out of hand, but all of the moderators have been on the ball and done a fantastic job of squelching anything that gets out of bounds.
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Ari Rahikkala
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Joined: 02 Oct 2002
Posts: 370
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2003 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whee. It's a good thing we have these OTW and GFF forums, you know. If we didn't and this had happened without a place for two dozen people to go "grow a thicker skin, damnit, and stop reading those trolls" simultaneously the support forums would have become quite a bit less useful for a while ;)...
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Cerement
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Joined: 14 Jun 2003
Posts: 404

PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2003 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ari Rahikkala wrote:
There is no enemy
anywhere.

There is no friend
anywhere.

:P Hail Eris!
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pilla
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Joined: 07 Aug 2002
Posts: 7214
Location: Pelotas, BR

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hadn't heard about ebrostig leaving yet, can somebody point me the thread?
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think4urs11
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Joined: 25 Jun 2003
Posts: 6659
Location: above the cloud

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should be this one, shouldn't it?

http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic.php?t=119764
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pjp
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Joined: 16 Apr 2002
Posts: 16114
Location: Colorado

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Be aware that we cannot police every single post/thread that gets submitted to the forums, nor do I think we should try. As long as posts follow the "Guidelines (READ BEFORE POSTING)" thread in the News & Announcements forum, we are inclined to not interfere with threads. Obviously, there are exceptions.

If at any time a poster chooses to not play by the guidelines, a moderator should be informed. Particularly, we don't like people disrespecting or insulting others. There is simply no instance when it is acceptable.

If we aren't informed, we can't try to solve the problem. In many cases, its just an instance of a heated discussion getting a little out of hand. With repeat offenders, we will lock their accounts, but we are very lenient with how many warnings we give. We'd rather not disable accounts.

Before informing a moderator about a "violation", take a few moments (minutes, an hour) to step back from what you've read. Disagreements of opinion are NOT justification to lock threads or accounts. If you think someone is being too thick headed about something, move on. If they come out and write "You are an idiot!" or something similar, let us know. Maybe you could PM the user and have an "offline" discussion. If they don't apologize (including publicly), let us know.

Accept OTW for what it is and don't expect more from it than it is worth.

Having said that, if anyone has suggestions on how to limit any of the issues addressed in the original post, please let us know.
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klieber
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Joined: 17 Apr 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I posted a similar thread in OTW. To recap: We are not going to moderate viewpoints. We are going to moderate professionalism and courtesy. If someone disagrees with you, too bad. Deal with it. If someone loses sight of the fact that we all need to be courteous of one another and voice our differences in a respectful manner, then please let one of the moderators know and we will handle the issue.

--kurt
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zhenlin
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Joined: 09 Nov 2002
Posts: 1361

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe that axing OTW is probably the best thing to do for now. At least put it under lock and key.

Around 1999, I was a member of a forum that had rather strict moderation and administration. It was a good place to go to extract information. Controversial topics were few and far between -- but then again, this is a children's/teens' forum I'm talking about. The ruleset was unambigous: you're innocent, you've been warned once, twice, three times, you've been banned.

I stopped visiting around 2001 - mainly because I changed my interests. Then, when I decided to go looking for it in 2003, it was completely gone. I can only make guesses about what happened -- even the owner doesn't like to talk about it much.

If this is a Gentoo Discussion Forums -- keep the discussion Gentoo related. If this a Gentoo Support Forum -- keep the discussion Gentoo related, with an emphasis on tech support. If this is a Gentoo Community Forum -- do whatever you like.

It is important to set some clear, unambigous objectives. What is this forum for? What rules must be applied to keep it that way? What do we do when people do not adhere to the rules?
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