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flysideways
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Catch and Release.
CNN wrote:
Both suspects have been arrested and convicted in the past, including on assault charges, according to the chief.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course they were released; they're just babies. With Skittles.
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So did any of you figure this out yet? With Trayvon Martin, the story wasn't murder: the story was miscarriage of justice and racial profiling. No miscarriage of justice = no story. That's not to say Delbert Benton's killing doesn't matter but it doesn't have an angle and, like it or not, everyday murders don't have much news value.

The angle, if there is one, is how we created two kids capable of doing such a thing. If you really want to reduce violence you'd have to do something about guns and economic deprivation. You'd have to think how best to create a society where people don't prey upon each other. The right, not the left, is the real problem there.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This gentleman has some good observations:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5ZyLAGumDo

Here's the incident he's talking about:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcPw0JRXccc#t=31s
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flysideways
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pantsonfire wrote:
So did any of you figure this out yet? With Trayvon Martin, the story wasn't murder: the story was miscarriage of justice and racial profiling. No miscarriage of justice = no story. That's not to say Delbert Benton's killing doesn't matter but it doesn't have an angle and, like it or not, everyday murders don't have much news value.

The angle, if there is one, is how we created two kids capable of doing such a thing. If you really want to reduce violence you'd have to do something about guns and economic deprivation. You'd have to think how best to create a society where people don't prey upon each other. The right, not the left, is the real problem there.


You and your like are a stain upon the concept of a civil society. You don't fucking get it. In a civil society populated by persons with a concept of what is just, retribution is not needed. All you see is the meting of punishment not the restraint, or lack thereof, that distinguishes a man from an animal. Expect others and yourself to do what is right. It is a miscarriage of justice when a person takes the life of another to their own benefit. How or whether punishment is administered is a secondary consideration that occurs only after the first failure.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pantsonfire wrote:
So did any of you figure this out yet? With Trayvon Martin, the story wasn't murder: the story was miscarriage of justice and racial profiling. No miscarriage of justice = no story. That's not to say Delbert Benton's killing doesn't matter but it doesn't have an angle and, like it or not, everyday murders don't have much news value.

You're missing the whole point. There was no "miscarriage of justice". That was manufactured from nothing in spite of facts to the contrary, so it was not, in fact newsworthy at all. In fact, the media had a DUTY to society to report things honestly and accurately which they violated egregiously in their coverage of this incident. People are being killed because of their dishonest, inflammatory, spin-heavy, activist, and at times downright libelous reporting of this story. They made up your "miscarriage of justice", and that farce of a trial held without evidence proved that. Your little equation is right, and there should have been no story, because the cops and the DA did nothing wrong to begin with.

You're also wrong that only miscarriages of justice are worthy of national news coverage. While killings happen routinely (from a national perspective), the fact that we've had a growing epidemic of violence perpetrated by young black males is a national problem. It's the main reason our murder rates are out of whack with other similar countries, and one of the top two reasons we have so many people in prison. It's not a racist issue; they're killing and beating the shit out of each other far more than anybody else. Yet that story is buried by the liberal media, except in the form of sanitized metadata used to argue that guns are the problem, because they're afraid of stigmatizing African Americans. People are dying by the thousands; there is no room for political correctness. If we can't be open and honest about our problems, we're never going to solve them.
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"The accumulation of all power, legislative, executive, and judiciary in the same hands...may justly be pronounced the very definition of tyranny."
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Last edited by Bones McCracker on Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:16 pm; edited 2 times in total
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
There was no "miscarriage of justice". That was manufactured from nothing in spite of facts to the contrary, so it was not, in fact newsworthy at all.


Thousands of hours of TV coverage and a solid mile of newsprint suggest a flaw in your reasoning.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That would be begging the question. Big time. :lol:

Here, I'll give you link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question

Also, I think you read the first line of my post and compulsively knee-jerked, immediately blurting out whatever came to mind.
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pantsonfire wrote:
The angle, if there is one, is how we created two kids capable of doing such a thing. If you really want to reduce violence you'd have to do something about guns and economic deprivation.

Guns? Good gravy. No gun was involved in either this case or when those black kids beat up the other kid on the bus. To look at this event and blame guns leads me to question whether or not you're really self-aware.

As for economic situations, I grew up dirt poor on the mission field with almost none of the comforts that my peers back in the mainland had and I have an astonishingly large criminal record. By that, I mean my criminal record is clean. I didn't start fights and I stayed out of trouble. Why? Because when I was five years old, my old man told told me to keep my hands to myself, and that I needed to respect others. That day at the playground, I ignored him and started bullying others around. He spanked the hell out of me for it and I never did it again. I didn't need to grow up wealthy, I needed discipline. That was the last time I went around starting things with people.
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John-Boy
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pantsonfire wrote:
If you really want to reduce violence


Or punish properly.
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@wswartzendruber

Kids learn in school what to do if a nutter comes to kill you. Some even get practical experience. They see nice adults from the NRA explaining that the solution is more guns. They grow up thinking that being armed is normal. Frequent gun murders are normal. Stand your ground is normal.

It isn't normal. It's f*cked up. It's part of a culture of violence which creates a lot of fear and disregard for human life. That encourages all kinds of violence, guns or no.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wswartzendruber wrote:
pantsonfire wrote:
The angle, if there is one, is how we created two kids capable of doing such a thing. If you really want to reduce violence you'd have to do something about guns and economic deprivation.

Guns? Good gravy. No gun was involved in either this case or when those black kids beat up the other kid on the bus. To look at this event and blame guns leads me to question whether or not you're really self-aware.

As for economic situations, I grew up dirt poor on the mission field with almost none of the comforts that my peers back in the mainland had and I have an astonishingly large criminal record. By that, I mean my criminal record is clean. I didn't start fights and I stayed out of trouble. Why? Because when I was five years old, my old man told told me to keep my hands to myself, and that I needed to respect others. That day at the playground, I ignored him and started bullying others around. He spanked the hell out of me for it and I never did it again. I didn't need to grow up wealthy, I needed discipline. That was the last time I went around starting things with people.

ZOMG no. We can't allow people to make moral and ethical judgments for themselves! If they did that, they might question the authority of the state and even resent their subjugation! Just put everybody naked in padded rooms so it's impossible for them to hurt themselves or each other, or to resist.

You know what else, even the violence we did have in culture, not long ago, was mostly reinforcing those moral and ethical lessons. If there was somebody on TV shooting somebody or beating somebody up, it was the guy protecting people's rights (or at least he won in the end). Now, our entertainment industries are entertaining people by making bad guys (those violating the rights of others) the heroes. Sherriff Matt Dillion on Gunsmoke was one of my heroes. He killed people, but only to protect people and save lives, and only when he was forced into it, and usually in a fair fight.

Now, kids are being taught something else by society.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:08 am    Post subject: Re: Delbert Benton and Christopher Lane Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
Delbert Benton and Christopher Lane Hate Crimes Show a Massive Racial Divide in America

Quote:
Described as "the kind of nice old man who'd become your friend in minutes," WWII veteran Delbert "Shorty" Benton was assaulted by two teens in the parking lot of the Eagles Lodge in Spokane, Washington, at around 8 p.m. Wednesday. He died in the hospital Thursday morning. Benton's death has already gone viral, and is uncovering deep racial divides, simmering anger and disgust with the media.

Much of the rage in the Benton case seems like a reaction to the non-stop media coverage of the Trayvon Martin shooting, which accellerated to 24-7 during the lengthy trial of George Zimmerman. People are rightfully asking why the Zimmerman trial was more important than many world news events, and questioning the assertion by many that Trayvon Martin's shooting death was a premeditated hate crime.

But after the Delbert Benton crime and other recent murders, such as the death of Australian student-athlete Christopher Lane, the media has been more restrained. Even President Obama, who commented on the Geroge Zimmerman trial, has remained silent about race, bringing into question why he chose to speak out for Tryvon Martin, but not for an elderly veteran or foreign student.


I have only read a couple of articles on this, but I don't see evidence for a hate crime. Where is it?
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wswartzendruber wrote:
Well, every group has its nutjobs, and the Second Amendment crowd is no exception.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
So why all the airtime for Zimmerman? think of all the other cases that could have been aired in the wasted, racist conformational biased media agenda that was pushed for soo many month's?


pantsonfire mentioned this, but I elaborate on the list. sensationalist politicians and media are one issue. But the other problem is that an unarmed black teen minding his on business was shot followed by a man with a gun and got shot by that gun and got off. Sounds newworthy to me.

Quote:

All murders should at least get a mention on the local news, the most heinous on national news, otherwise society cannot see or appreciate how rotten it is becoming.
The Zimmerman farce has probably done more harm than the murder itself.


you are talking about gunnutland here. chicago has about as many murders as the UK. LA has more. if they reported every murder that's all they would be talking in the papers.
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wswartzendruber wrote:
Well, every group has its nutjobs, and the Second Amendment crowd is no exception.
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