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energyman76b
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/145161
Quote:

According to an amazing police report released there this month, every single solved case of assault-rape in the country in 2010 was carried out by a Muslim immigrant.


http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/4274
Quote:

The police in the Norwegian capital Oslo revealed that 2009 set yet another record: compared to 2008, there were twice as many cases of assault rapes. In each and every case, not only in 2008 and 2009 but also in 2007, the offender was a non-Western immigrant. At the same time, in 9 out of 10 cases, the victim was Norwegian, not just by nationality, but also by ethnicity


ok, Norway, not Sweden - but do you might see a pattern?

Quote:

A few years ago Australia had a wave of pack rapes and rape waves targetting white women, perpetrated by muslims of various stripes, even brother teams. Then to cool down the situation sheik el hilaly famously compared men and women as cats and uncovered meat. Classy man.


I feel rather insulted that immigrants are being compared to muslims who rape. These stats say nothing about other immigrants at all and sure enough in other places crime has dropped as immigration has sky rocketed.

by all means, however, we should help prevent these crimes.


really? please name a few.

Btw:
https://www.destatis.de/DE/ZahlenFakten/GesellschaftStaat/Rechtspflege/Strafverfolgung/Tabellen/AuslaendischeVerurteilte.html

Straftaten insgesamt 177 575 22,0 49 381 27,8

immigrants are responsible for 22% of all crimes. (immigrants below 25 make up 27,8% of that group).

Compared with the ca 8,8% of immigrants in the overall population...

(this does not count crimes by immigrants who got a german passport. Or it would look a lot worse).
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 11:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

name a few what?

I can give you a hint on solving your problem. give immigrants jobs, and not shitty ones. You say that they are unwilling to work. Groups have done studies in france and germany where identical CVs are distributed with french and muslim names (in france) and german and turkish names (in germany). Guess what? I am sure I don't need to tell you the outcome.

In the americas (US and Canada) they don't really practice this overt racism as done in Europe. Guess what? You don't see this phenomenon (as I said, crime has been falling as immigration rates have gone up). The over represented group in Canadian prison is natives and in american prison it is blacks, neither immigrants.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Canada practices overt racism too, keeping U.S. blacks and Mexicans from immigrating.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Canada practices overt racism too, keeping U.S. blacks and Mexicans from immigrating.

They do? I understand the Mexican angle, but US blacks vs Whites? How does that work? *edit* oh wait, is this to do with the statistical probability of blacks having a felony record compared to whites?


Last edited by sikpuppy on Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Canada practices overt racism too, keeping U.S. blacks and Mexicans from immigrating.


don't forget american whites. we keep them out too. And asians.

it ain't the EU, which is a shame.
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energyman76b
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
name a few what?

I can give you a hint on solving your problem. give immigrants jobs, and not shitty ones. You say that they are unwilling to work. Groups have done studies in france and germany where identical CVs are distributed with french and muslim names (in france) and german and turkish names (in germany). Guess what? I am sure I don't need to tell you the outcome.

In the americas (US and Canada) they don't really practice this overt racism as done in Europe. Guess what? You don't see this phenomenon (as I said, crime has been falling as immigration rates have gone up). The over represented group in Canadian prison is natives and in american prison it is blacks, neither immigrants.


name a few places where crime went down while immigration went up - oh and stuff like this does not count:

1000 natives: 100 crimes/jear

next:
1000 nates: 50 crimes/year
10 immigrants: 25 crimes/year.

Yes, the crimes number went down. But not thanks to the immigrants.

And stop preaching about 'those poor immigrants' - billions have been pumped into special programs for immigrants. Free German classes. Heavily reduced fees for German classes. All kinds of (expensive) help and 'inclusion' programs.
But a certain part of the population (turks, albanians and other muslims) just refuse to take part. And if you refuse even to learn the local language - how are you supposed to get a good job?

I have a good solution:
2nd generation and not fluent in local language? Still not naturalized? Off you go.
Not a german passport and criminal? Off you go.

That would solve all the problems. Quickly.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

energyman76b wrote:
juniper wrote:
name a few what?

I can give you a hint on solving your problem. give immigrants jobs, and not shitty ones. You say that they are unwilling to work. Groups have done studies in france and germany where identical CVs are distributed with french and muslim names (in france) and german and turkish names (in germany). Guess what? I am sure I don't need to tell you the outcome.

In the americas (US and Canada) they don't really practice this overt racism as done in Europe. Guess what? You don't see this phenomenon (as I said, crime has been falling as immigration rates have gone up). The over represented group in Canadian prison is natives and in american prison it is blacks, neither immigrants.


name a few places where crime went down while immigration went up - oh and stuff like this does not count:

1000 natives: 100 crimes/jear

next:
1000 nates: 50 crimes/year
10 immigrants: 25 crimes/year.

Yes, the crimes number went down. But not thanks to the immigrants.

And stop preaching about 'those poor immigrants' - billions have been pumped into special programs for immigrants. Free German classes. Heavily reduced fees for German classes. All kinds of (expensive) help and 'inclusion' programs.
But a certain part of the population (turks, albanians and other muslims) just refuse to take part. And if you refuse even to learn the local language - how are you supposed to get a good job?

I have a good solution:
2nd generation and not fluent in local language? Still not naturalized? Off you go.
Not a german passport and criminal? Off you go.

That would solve all the problems. Quickly.


USA, Canada, 1970 to now. Or most major cities in US and Canada. Toronto has more than 1/2 of its population now foreign born, but crime has been dropping for about 25 years.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
juniper wrote:
name a few what?

I can give you a hint on solving your problem. give immigrants jobs, and not shitty ones. You say that they are unwilling to work. Groups have done studies in france and germany where identical CVs are distributed with french and muslim names (in france) and german and turkish names (in germany). Guess what? I am sure I don't need to tell you the outcome.

In the americas (US and Canada) they don't really practice this overt racism as done in Europe. Guess what? You don't see this phenomenon (as I said, crime has been falling as immigration rates have gone up). The over represented group in Canadian prison is natives and in american prison it is blacks, neither immigrants.


name a few places where crime went down while immigration went up - oh and stuff like this does not count:

1000 natives: 100 crimes/jear

next:
1000 nates: 50 crimes/year
10 immigrants: 25 crimes/year.

Yes, the crimes number went down. But not thanks to the immigrants.

And stop preaching about 'those poor immigrants' - billions have been pumped into special programs for immigrants. Free German classes. Heavily reduced fees for German classes. All kinds of (expensive) help and 'inclusion' programs.
But a certain part of the population (turks, albanians and other muslims) just refuse to take part. And if you refuse even to learn the local language - how are you supposed to get a good job?

I have a good solution:
2nd generation and not fluent in local language? Still not naturalized? Off you go.
Not a german passport and criminal? Off you go.

That would solve all the problems. Quickly.


USA, Canada, 1970 to now. Or most major cities in US and Canada. Toronto has more than 1/2 of its population now foreign born, but crime has been dropping for about 25 years.



need to add reported in.
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energyman76b
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
juniper wrote:
name a few what?

I can give you a hint on solving your problem. give immigrants jobs, and not shitty ones. You say that they are unwilling to work. Groups have done studies in france and germany where identical CVs are distributed with french and muslim names (in france) and german and turkish names (in germany). Guess what? I am sure I don't need to tell you the outcome.

In the americas (US and Canada) they don't really practice this overt racism as done in Europe. Guess what? You don't see this phenomenon (as I said, crime has been falling as immigration rates have gone up). The over represented group in Canadian prison is natives and in american prison it is blacks, neither immigrants.


name a few places where crime went down while immigration went up - oh and stuff like this does not count:

1000 natives: 100 crimes/jear

next:
1000 nates: 50 crimes/year
10 immigrants: 25 crimes/year.

Yes, the crimes number went down. But not thanks to the immigrants.

And stop preaching about 'those poor immigrants' - billions have been pumped into special programs for immigrants. Free German classes. Heavily reduced fees for German classes. All kinds of (expensive) help and 'inclusion' programs.
But a certain part of the population (turks, albanians and other muslims) just refuse to take part. And if you refuse even to learn the local language - how are you supposed to get a good job?

I have a good solution:
2nd generation and not fluent in local language? Still not naturalized? Off you go.
Not a german passport and criminal? Off you go.

That would solve all the problems. Quickly.


USA, Canada, 1970 to now. Or most major cities in US and Canada. Toronto has more than 1/2 of its population now foreign born, but crime has been dropping for about 25 years.


and how many of those are muslims? Or from the balkans?
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Libertardian denial of reality is wholly unimpressive and unconvincing, and simply serves to demonstrate what a bunch of delusional fools they all are.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

energyman76b wrote:
and how many of those are muslims? Or from the balkans?


Very few. The Main influx of Muslims came from Somalia back in the 80s and 90s. The areas they moved to had their crime rates spike.

Europe is where the real problem with Muslim immigration exists.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
and how many of those are muslims? Or from the balkans?


Very few. The Main influx of Muslims came from Somalia back in the 80s and 90s. The areas they moved to had their crime rates spike.

Europe is where the real problem with Muslim immigration exists.


data please.

Indeed, more muslims in the EU. but its a chicken and egg phenomenon here. Turkish workers were originally brought in during labour shortages and weren't expected or welcome to stay. Even today you have issues in France and Germany, where identical CVs are distributed, one with a german/french name and one with a turkish/muslim name and the responses from employers is wildly different.

So, deport as many criminals as you like, but until you solve the problems that come in parisian banlieues don't expect the problem to go away.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
and how many of those are muslims? Or from the balkans?


Very few. The Main influx of Muslims came from Somalia back in the 80s and 90s. The areas they moved to had their crime rates spike.

Europe is where the real problem with Muslim immigration exists.


data please.


FFS, look it up yourself. I have family that live in Minnesota where large numbers of Somali Muslims immigrated during the 80s and 90s, and crime shot way up. These formerly safe neighborhoods (made up mostly of Scandinavians) now have serious crime to deal with.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
Even today you have issues in France and Germany, where identical CVs are distributed, one with a german/french name and one with a turkish/muslim name and the responses from employers is wildly different.

If one person is culturally indigenous and the other is not, then they are not same. This can be critical in many jobs, affecting things like communication ability (which is not just about language). You think screening resumes is not entirely a game of probabilities? Nothing on a resume is a guarantee; only indicators.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
and how many of those are muslims? Or from the balkans?


Very few. The Main influx of Muslims came from Somalia back in the 80s and 90s. The areas they moved to had their crime rates spike.

Europe is where the real problem with Muslim immigration exists.


data please.


FFS, look it up yourself. I have family that live in Minnesota where large numbers of Somali Muslims immigrated during the 80s and 90s, and crime shot way up. These formerly safe neighborhoods (made up mostly of Scandinavians) now have serious crime to deal with.


you made the claim i didn't.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
juniper wrote:
Even today you have issues in France and Germany, where identical CVs are distributed, one with a german/french name and one with a turkish/muslim name and the responses from employers is wildly different.

If one person is culturally indigenous and the other is not, then they are not same. This can be critical in many jobs, affecting things like communication ability (which is not just about language). You think screening resumes is not entirely a game of probabilities? Nothing on a resume is a guarantee; only indicators.


doctored so that turks spoke german and grew up in germany. etc

http://news.stanford.edu/news/2010/november/muslim-france-study-112210.html

all over the place.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).


Not all cultures are equal, Juniper. With the marketplace of ideas, some ideas rise and some fall. The reason why so many Mulsims leave their shithole countries is because of the backwards, bronze age cultures that run them. They then seem to get homesick and start importing that garbage to the West.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).


Not all cultures are equal, Juniper. With the marketplace of ideas, some ideas rise and some fall. The reason why so many Mulsims leave their shithole countries is because of the backwards, bronze age cultures that run them. They then seem to get homesick and start importing that garbage to the West.

Or moving back to the enclaves, so their children can grow up around "positive" role models.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).


Not all cultures are equal, Juniper. With the marketplace of ideas, some ideas rise and some fall. The reason why so many Mulsims leave their shithole countries is because of the backwards, bronze age cultures that run them. They then seem to get homesick and start importing that garbage to the West.


that was my point. So labelling it an immigration problem misses the mark. in both the US and Canada (and perhaps britain) the crime is disproportionately done by non-immigrants. So, what's the common current? it isn't immigration.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New York Times wrote:
Non-citizen criminals represent a significant percentage of American prisoners: in 2009, some 25 percent of federal prisoners and a smaller fraction of state prisoners were non-citizens;
Hmmm, 25%. Are 25% of the people in the US non-citizens?

Center for Immigration Studies wrote:
DHS states that it has identified 221,000 non-citizens in the nation’s jails. This equals 11 to 15 percent of the jail population. Non-citizens comprise only 8.6 percent of the nation’s total adult population. ... In 2009, 57 percent of the 76 fugitive murderers most wanted by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) were foreign-born. It is likely however that because immigrants can more readily flee to other countries, they comprise a disproportionate share of fugitives.


Texas Department of Criminal Justice wrote:
Of the total incarcerated in state jails and prisons in March 2006, 11,514 claimed to have been born in a foreign country and 10,280 claimed that they hold foreign citizenship. These claims are based on TDCJ’s intake interviews and records forwarded with the prisoners and are subject to investigation and verification by ICE.


KVUE News wrote:
In some cases, Bradley has seen the same offenders returning to Texas to re-offend.


The Boston Globe wrote:
Many freed criminals avoid deportation, strike again


US Department of Justice wrote:
b
Includes all conditional release violators returned to prison for violations of conditions of release or for new crimes.


The Dreaded Faux News (I included this more for the pic than any other reason.) wrote:
The report found that the number of attacks on Border Patrol agents increased 46 percent to 1,097 incidents in fiscal 2008. The report said the assaults were mostly related to immigrant smuggling.



We are told that it is important to take drastic measures in order to prevent just one loss of life, yet ...

Separately, on the subject of prison inc., notice that the growth of private prisons is at the federal and not state level.

And lastly,
US Department of Justice wrote:
Presence of weapons in violent incidents, by type, 2009
no weapon was used in the commission of 73% of violent crime.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kill someone in Houston. Drive away following the speed limit and you can be out of the country in 5 hours and 43 minutes. It happens.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).


Not all cultures are equal, Juniper. With the marketplace of ideas, some ideas rise and some fall. The reason why so many Mulsims leave their shithole countries is because of the backwards, bronze age cultures that run them. They then seem to get homesick and start importing that garbage to the West.


that was my point. So labelling it an immigration problem misses the mark. in both the US and Canada (and perhaps britain) the crime is disproportionately done by non-immigrants. So, what's the common current? it isn't immigration.

So what's your point here? That immigrants calling for Jihad against the culture of their new homeland is not a problem (because it does not account for a majority of crime)? Sounds like broken logic to me.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).


Not all cultures are equal, Juniper. With the marketplace of ideas, some ideas rise and some fall. The reason why so many Mulsims leave their shithole countries is because of the backwards, bronze age cultures that run them. They then seem to get homesick and start importing that garbage to the West.


that was my point. So labelling it an immigration problem misses the mark. in both the US and Canada (and perhaps britain) the crime is disproportionately done by non-immigrants. So, what's the common current? it isn't immigration.

So what's your point here? That immigrants calling for Jihad against the culture of their new homeland is not a problem (because it does not account for a majority of crime)? Sounds like broken logic to me.


i never said that. it is a problem. as i said, whether or not he is allowed to say it should be independent of claiming welfare. why is that hard to understand?
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Multiculti has failed. It will take decades for assimilation to be complete and undo the damage. Controlled rates of immigration allowing room for assimilation and integration are successful.


ah, a free marketer has drawn the line. I just didn't know where it was (however, i don't disagree with your statement, but I am not a free market worshiper).


Not all cultures are equal, Juniper. With the marketplace of ideas, some ideas rise and some fall. The reason why so many Mulsims leave their shithole countries is because of the backwards, bronze age cultures that run them. They then seem to get homesick and start importing that garbage to the West.


that was my point. So labelling it an immigration problem misses the mark. in both the US and Canada (and perhaps britain) the crime is disproportionately done by non-immigrants. So, what's the common current? it isn't immigration.

So what's your point here? That immigrants calling for Jihad against the culture of their new homeland is not a problem (because it does not account for a majority of crime)? Sounds like broken logic to me.


i never said that. it is a problem. as i said, whether or not he is allowed to say it should be independent of claiming welfare. why is that hard to understand?

Sorry, I don't see anything about welfare in this series of statements. I thought you were arguing it's not an immigration problem. Besides, he's the one who connected it to welfare by instructing people to claim their Jihad seeker's allowance. To wit:
Quote:
He laughed as he told supporters:

“You find people are busy working the whole of their life. They wake up at 7 o’clock. They go to work at 9 o’clock. They work for eight, nine hours a day. They come home at 7 o’clock, watch EastEnders, sleep, and they do that for 40 years of their life. That is called slavery.

"And at the end of their life they realise their pension isn’t going to pay out anything, the mortgage isn’t going to pay out anything.

"Basically they are going to lose everything, commit suicide. What kind of a life is that, honestly. That is the life of kuffar (non-believer).”

Former lawyer Choudary — twice banned from running organisations under the Terrorism Act — said some revered Islamic figures had only ever worked one or two days a year, adding: “The rest of the year they were busy with jihad (holy war) and things like that.”

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