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BoneKracker
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:10 pm    Post subject: Deloitte: U.S. Debt Crisis is Worse that You Think Reply with quote

Soon, our interest payments on foreign debt alone will be enough to finance the Chinese military and is a huge amount that we need for other things.

At the moment, we are accruing debt at a rate of $4 Billion per day -- that's $750 per houshold per month -- which must be paid back, with interest. Over the coming decade, interest on debt will cost use $424 per month per household. That's interest alone.

Unfunded liabilities now total $50 Trillion. Government reports aren't as reliable as we like to think; the debt is highly sensitive to GDP fluctuations (a 1% variation makes a difference of Trillions over a few years).

An interesting analysis by Deloitte (click "download"):

http://www.deloitte.com/view/en_US/us/Insights/hot-topics/2012-Election/158e9fb774287310VgnVCM3000001c56f00aRCRD.htm
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This whole thing "economy growth through debt and consumption" is just a clever scheme. Corporate owners got rich, production moved elsewhere, americans were blindsided by bling (on loan), but the ultimate price will be payed by taxpayers, and it's not just the money, but the fact that after 20-30 years of that, US will be like a 3rd world country, with rich elite, and fuck all else.

At least china will have production capabilities and routines, its not just about ownership for a little guy, its about the fact that after 20 years of assembling electronics, chinese workers will be more attractive on market, than an american with bling.

But I might be too pessimistic, I call it age :)


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notageek
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me guess, because of Obama?
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

notageek wrote:
Let me guess, because of Obama?


Nah not really. Because of corporate greed. Started way before Obama, and its not gonna end with him.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

notageek wrote:
Let me guess, because of Obama?

How can you say that?! He's the one who is going to end all that! That's why we elected him, remember? Hope and Change! Forward!
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worse than I think?


Anyone available to tutor me in Mandarin?
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

interest, as a whole sum, isn't even possible to be paid back. although a lot of money is being printed out of thin air, so USians could theoretically pay back money that didn't exist before (the interest) with money they pretend exists but doesn't really (stimulus). so it seems USians are on the bottom of a lose-lose situation.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jonnevers wrote:
interest, as a whole sum, isn't even possible to be paid back. although a lot of money is being printed out of thin air, so USians could theoretically pay back money that didn't exist before (the interest) with money they pretend exists but doesn't really (stimulus). so it seems USians are on the bottom of a lose-lose situation.

A good first step would be not making it any worse. :lol:
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The worst thing governments & corporations have done is convince the populace debt doesn't matter, or that it matters less than they think. That debt and inflation will give us infinite growth. Both of which are false. The world is quickly running into a dead end where it will be necessary to either wipe off trillions of dollars of debt(both public and private) or inflate itself out of it. Unfortunately both will result in economic catastrophe, or even worse...war.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

petrjanda wrote:
The worst thing governments & corporations have done is convince the populace debt doesn't matter, or that it matters less than they think. That debt and inflation will give us infinite growth. Both of which are false. The world is quickly running into a dead end where it will be necessary to either wipe off trillions of dollars of debt(both public and private) or inflate itself out of it. Unfortunately both will result in economic catastrophe, or even worse...war.



I dunno, I just think its nuts, I mean middle class as I used to know it was gone in 1992 with the war, so while I was spinning in the orbit and lamenting that fact, it appeared that it's vanishing in countries that were the very definition of the word.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 4:47 am    Post subject: Re: Deloitte: U.S. Debt Crisis is Worse that You Think Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
which must be paid back

Who said it "must"?

Obama? The Hawaiian guy?
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:16 am    Post subject: Re: Deloitte: U.S. Debt Crisis is Worse that You Think Reply with quote

PaulBredbury wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
which must be paid back

Who said it "must"?

Obama? The Hawaiian guy?


I think chinese have a say as well :lol:
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erm67
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
notageek wrote:
Let me guess, because of Obama?

How can you say that?! He's the one who is going to end all that! That's why we elected him, remember? Hope and Change! Forward!


You forget the problem is how we got to the 2008 situation, that is how it all started.... what is happening now is a direct consequence of those actions.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

erm67 wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
notageek wrote:
Let me guess, because of Obama?

How can you say that?! He's the one who is going to end all that! That's why we elected him, remember? Hope and Change! Forward!


You forget the problem is how we got to the 2008 situation, that is how it all started.... what is happening now is a direct consequence of those actions.

It's the same problem. Ill-conceived social policy driving Government intervention in housing markets was the root cause that created artificially risky assets. The Democrats want to re-create that very situation. They keep trying to re-inflate the housing market. Another cause was the de-regulation that fueled the economic boom of the 90s (which they attribute to President Clinton, although the resulting financial crisis is, of course, Bush's fault).

In either case, I'm not forgetting anything, you're forgetting that Obama's big promise was that he could fix it, and he hasn't fixed shit.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Deloitte: U.S. Debt Crisis is Worse that You Think Reply with quote

Prenj wrote:
PaulBredbury wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
which must be paid back

Who said it "must"?

Obama? The Hawaiian guy?


I think chinese have a say as well :lol:

Most of our debt is to Americans, and they do want their money back someday, especially since they can no longer rely on Social Security and Medicare to provide for their most basic needs when they retire.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Deloitte: U.S. Debt Crisis is Worse that You Think Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Prenj wrote:
PaulBredbury wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
which must be paid back

Who said it "must"?

Obama? The Hawaiian guy?


I think chinese have a say as well :lol:

Most of our debt is to Americans, and they do want their money back someday, especially since they can no longer rely on Social Security and Medicare to provide for their most basic needs when they retire.


True. Some european prime ministers cleverly suggested that retirement age be moved to 75. How nice of them. :lol:
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PaulBredbury
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:35 am    Post subject: Re: Deloitte: U.S. Debt Crisis is Worse that You Think Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Most of our debt is to Americans, and they do want their money back someday

They will get their money back, when a loaf of bread costs £100.

What else do you expect?
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