a database file system??

syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

is their any way to mount a database as a filesystem??

id like to make an mp3 database to catalog and store my mp3 collection and hopefull optimize the space they take up, SQL is what im looking at right now but i wont do this if i cant access the database as if it were a filesystem.

id like to be able to do fast(VERY) searches by a variety of criteria such as album/title/artist/genre etc..... and a database seems to be the only answer....

any thoughts??

pjp · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 9:06 pm Post subject:

Not being a database person, I was anticipating pulling ID3 tag info from files into a dB.
Then using the dB for searches and "playing" them (the db would contain file location info).
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syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

im also interested in that, with the id3 tags but it would be nice to be able to back up my entire mp3 collection with just one file or the ability to mirror my collection accross the local 802.11b.........

i just read the "introduction and philosophy of reasierfs"

Reiser says that if you have to use any kind of layer on top of the file system to accomplish what you need done, then your files system is letting you down and it should be fixed....

i think thats reasonable thinking and im wondering why it hasnt been done yet? you know the ability to database id3 tags and metadata and whatever into the file system itself and have a file system index next to the journal.

schutten · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:01 am Post subject:

I second that, I'm also interested.

Also I'd like to setup a similar system for the photo's from my digital camera. This is basically a similar problem. A jpeg image with a set of information describing the image (date, location, description).

I soon as I have my "to be server" PC setup (with raid0 disks, I don't want to loose this data), I'll set this up (both for MP3 & photo's).

Options I am playing with:
- One integrated system, or two...
- One database, or database with tags + separate files (like the previous post suggests), or a "file system" that supports this (I'll look into this ReiserFS thing).

Will be a few weeks from now when I want to start, so first some thinking to do...

DArtagnan · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 6:13 am Post subject:

Houdini · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 7:25 am Post subject:

Oracle is really interested in that, as is Microsoft. Rumor is, soon Windows will be all SQL based. What fun that will be...

Anyway, why do you need a database filesystem? MP3 databases exist, and the db would be one file you could back up.

/me shrugs

I'm not one to stop a random idea though, so good luck

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pjp · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 3:40 pm Post subject:

Glad I got out when I did

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JefP@@ · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 4:12 pm Post subject:

a database as a filesystem, .. wouldn't that make it enormously ? and thereby very low performance in searching & hard to backup ?

A database with all the mp3 info & the info where to find it on your harddriver, would seem much easier. Maybe you could write a frontend for it ... somth where you can search for an artist / album and immediateley play the song(s).. shouldn't be very difficult ... You can write some scripts to verify wheter mp3s have gone missing etc ...

Grtz

S_aIN_t · Guru Joined: 11 May 2002 Posts: 488 Location: Ottawa

it is intersting for me to see that.. i have been thinking about writing the same thing. the only problme is that i would have to learn alot more than i know right now.

i mean i dont know that much about SQL or anything that i could acess with.. but from what i hear MySQL is fairly easy to administer and SQL as a language is not difficult to use. or maybe i will use Python and write a web front end for the db.

anyway, i guess quite a few people have the same ideas.. :)

chatwood2 · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 4:32 pm Post subject:

you guys might want to look at netjuke ([url]netjuke.sourceforge.net[/url]).

It scanns the ID3 tags of mp3s, puts the info in a db (mysql or postgres), and allows you to search, make playlists, etc. The interface is web-based, and it plays your mp3s over the web too. The best way to describe it is that it is a xmms/winamp/itunes app that exists only on the web.

What it has allowed me do is listen to all my mp3s, where-ever I am. I have one server with my music and netjuke running on it, and if I have a internet connection I can listen to the music.

- Chris[/url]

syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

most mp3 or picture databases i have seen do not have network functionallity, i dont want to be stuck with a program on a certain platform. i dont want an mp3 database that is only usable with the program that administers the database unless it is network transparent, as in i can mount the database as a file system and use it over my network. and no im not interested in a web based system. i have never been satisfied with a web based anything that is not the web itself.

here are my needs:
1) must be mountable as a file system, or have an interface that is able to be used accross a network.
2) must search for file info quickly
3) doesn't really have to be fast at reading files, mp3s and pictures dont requier a lot of speed to play reliably...
4) be open source. period, no proprietary software....i run NO proprietary software except my NVdriver....
5) be flexible...open to improvement...usable

tba · Apprentice Joined: 01 Jun 2002 Posts: 173

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AutoBot · l33t Joined: 22 Apr 2002 Posts: 968 Location: Usually Out

I'm curious as to why if BeOS was so good (not saying it wasn't), why did the project die ?

I've heard upper-management decisions caused the demise but this seems unlikely, it would seem more that enough copys weren't purchased and funding was deemed inappropriate?
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klieber · Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2002 7:28 pm Post subject:

um...not sure where the hell this thread should go. It's all over the board.

I didn't see anything gentoo-specific in it, so off to General Linux it goes. (the other choice is OTW, which is where it's going if you guys continue along the BeOS thread...

)

--kurt
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tba · Apprentice Joined: 01 Jun 2002 Posts: 173

Autobot,
at one time BeOS was going to be shipped stock with Dell's but Microsoft strongarmed that deal away. It is evidence in the DOJ's and Be Inc.s suits against Microsoft (unless they have been class actioned into one now).

Look at Netscape's usage decline since Explorer became stock in win9x. Something like 1-3%. How much of the end user desktop does linux have? People like you and me and others on this forum are very unlike the average pc/mac consumer. I'm not taking anything away from netscape, beos, or linux, but 99.5% of the population will not install a new browser, much less a new os, because they are scared. If what shipped with the computer works they dont want to learn, much less break anything else, to see if something else works better, and in all likelyhood, if there is a driver for their hardware. The truth is windows works just fine for the web and e-mail; what most people care about.

And since everything in their world is and has been microsoft, they dont even know what better is until redmond tells them. When my buddies see my computer used they ask why my background changes when windows diappear. I proceed to explain that i have more than one desktop.

I could go on. It is possible to boot to beos from windows98se and earlier, by clicking on an icon. Post-win98 that was "broken." BeOS boots in 5-10 seconds on an average PC of a year ago. The consumer would never see that using a boot disk, and so would have to know to install it, make his own partition, reinstall it from within beos (a completely new os), and delete the original instance from control panel in windows or it will automount all bfs partitions on boot (even if they are images within another fs, it works fine but may be confusing for a beginner).

It is just really difficult for a commercial desktop os to survive with the situation being the way it is. It doesnt help that marketing was word-of-mouth at best (mast people have never heard of BeOS), and the IA market that Be Inc. gambled on cost them the house. They actually turned their first profit the year before the infamous focus shift to BeIA.

It's not dead though, slowed yes, dead no. There are at least 4 promising open sourece projects, some partially based on beos, some promising binary compatibility; most are in alpha, one (cosmoe) was released 2 weeks ago, and is at developer's v.52.

On my gentoo box, i can tell that from 2.0 to 3.0 kde went out and addressed the BeOS refugee market. I could name at least 6 features that make kde 3.0 behave more similarly to BeOS (and better in most instances), but this has gone on long enough

so yes enought copies were not sold (to support a small corporation) and funding was deemed inappropriate (or too dangerous (see: microsoft)), but history has shown: product superiority does not a success make. If that were the case we'd be recording onto betamax film from 3rd party cableboxes running embedded linux (or even less likely grandma would use gentoo

static · Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2002 8:34 pm Post subject:

klieber was right. I see Database filesystems as the emeny after hearing what M$ was planning... and; this thread seems a little OT with all the BeOS talk!
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AutoBot · l33t Joined: 22 Apr 2002 Posts: 968 Location: Usually Out

Yep sorry for asking such a question, I usually stick with the subject but I was just too curious and knew it would get answered by an un-biased person.
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mksoft · l33t Joined: 28 May 2002 Posts: 844

syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

ok, im not interested in BeOS right at this moment, its great but im on the B.E.OS and OpenBEOS forums so ill go their to talk be.

so what im interested in is getting the right file system setup for my gentoo system. people have had some different ideas on which is fastest and which is most stable in gentoo.

no please continue with semi-on-topic replys

tba · Apprentice Joined: 01 Jun 2002 Posts: 173

ill stay on topic.

syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

why would database filesystems be the enemy? bacause M$ is planning on using one?? i dont understand this? just because M$ is planning on going with some sort of a database, that doesnt mean us gentoo guys should blow it off. i want to improve functionallity and performance of my file system for my gentoo install, that simple, just cause m$ want to improve windows should i say screw it?

crevette · Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2002 4:27 pm Post subject: Micro$oft always lies

They also said they created id3 attributes for mp3, but I use them for more than 2 years on beos.
Micro$oft steal technologies
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klieber · Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2002 4:45 pm Post subject:

OK folks -- I think this conversation has ranged sufficiently OT to warrant a lock. Never mind the libel...

--kurt
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