Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Quick Search: in
THe difference
View unanswered posts
View posts from last 24 hours

 
Reply to topic    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Off the Wall
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
pantoffel
n00b
n00b


Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 6:46 pm    Post subject: THe difference Reply with quote

Hi,

I was wondering what the difrents are between :
x86
sparc
PowerPC

I was olso wondering if there are difrent types op processors for those arch (for x86 you have intel, amd ... )
To be honest , i never heard\used a Sparc or a PowerPC , so can someone please explain me in nOOb
langue the difrents between those arch , and what makes them so great.


Last edited by pantoffel on Fri Feb 28, 2003 11:20 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lovechild
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 17 May 2002
Posts: 2858
Location: Århus, Denmark

PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Power PC (PPC) is used in Macs mostly (I don't know any other computers that use these chips)

Sparc is mostly used in Sun Servers, hefty bastards..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
squanto
Guru
Guru


Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 524
Location: Rochester, NY, USA

PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2003 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not all that up on the stuff, but here goes:
PPC is a RISC based architecture. Sparc is as well, I think, but not sure. While x86 is CISC. Sparc and PPC are not the same, they are not even made by similar companies. IBM and moto make PPC while sun makes the sparc.
RISC stands for reduced instruction set while CISC stands for complicated instruction set.

Basically with a CISC machine, each instruction that the cpu can do can be any length up to around 7 or 8 bytes (i think). So some instructions are only 1 byte like pushing one register onto the stack. While doing a complicated multiply ( like: 0f af 44 9e fc imul 0xfffffffc(%esi,%ebx,4),%eax, which is multiplying numbers in an array by the value in eax and storing the result into eax) can be much longer. CISC also incorperates lots of old outdated instructions that aren't really used anymore.

On RISC, every instruction is the same length, so a simple push or a complicated multiply will both be the same length. This has advantages, as on average the instructions are usually shorter and get executed faster. Also, part of the "reduced" is the fact that unneeded instructions are not included for the processor.

Also, on most IA-32 (32 bit intel) processors, there are only a few general purpose registers, registers hold values that the processor are working on at the moment. Whereas in some chips there will be something on the order of upto 32 registers, which can improve performance.

Some of the sparc systems (if not all) are 64 bit as well, which is important for certain apps, and for being able to use over 4GB of ram, which many people are starting to need in engineering and graphic design.

Im not quite sure the differences between intel and amd, they both have to conform to the x86 standard, so in that sense they are very similar. Although the way that the pentium 4 and the athlon do computations are slightly different. The differences are not that great, but for one thing, the pentium4 has a very long pipeline which means that it takes longer for any one thing to happen, but that they can crank up the clock speed like the bejesus, while amd has shorter and wider pipelines so they can do more per clock cycle, this is why amd is pushing their comparisons between amd chips and intel, such as the 2000+XP, saying that it is equivilent to a 2GHz pentium4.

PPC chips, made by IBM and motorola are used in IBMs blade servers and their R/S6000 series computers as well as some of their mainframes I believe.

If you want more info, intel has lots of stuff on their site, you just have to find it, while if you want info on sun stuff, have fun. Sun's site is almost impossible to find anything on :roll:

If I have confused you more than you were before, let me know and I will try to clear up my self.

-Andrew
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SanitysEj
n00b
n00b


Joined: 13 Feb 2003
Posts: 29
Location: I think I'm here, not sure.

PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2003 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Squanto,

If you're "not all that up on stuff", I believe that a person who was would give me far too much material to digest in one sitting. :wink:
My point, thanx much for the post, It was very informative and fairly well put together.
Kudos
_________________
Universally,
Ej

"Try?! There is no Try!!! There is do, and there is do not!!!!" -YODA
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
pantoffel
n00b
n00b


Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2003 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

squanto wrote:
I'm not all that up on the stuff, but here goes:
PPC is a RISC based architecture. Sparc is as well, I think, but not sure. While x86 is CISC. Sparc and PPC are not the same, they are not even made by similar companies. IBM and moto make PPC while sun makes the sparc.
RISC stands for reduced instruction set while CISC stands for complicated instruction set.

Basically with a CISC machine, each instruction that the cpu can do can be any length up to around 7 or 8 bytes (i think). So some instructions are only 1 byte like pushing one register onto the stack. While doing a complicated multiply ( like: 0f af 44 9e fc imul 0xfffffffc(%esi,%ebx,4),%eax, which is multiplying numbers in an array by the value in eax and storing the result into eax) can be much longer. CISC also incorperates lots of old outdated instructions that aren't really used anymore.

On RISC, every instruction is the same length, so a simple push or a complicated multiply will both be the same length. This has advantages, as on average the instructions are usually shorter and get executed faster. Also, part of the "reduced" is the fact that unneeded instructions are not included for the processor.

Also, on most IA-32 (32 bit intel) processors, there are only a few general purpose registers, registers hold values that the processor are working on at the moment. Whereas in some chips there will be something on the order of upto 32 registers, which can improve performance.

Some of the sparc systems (if not all) are 64 bit as well, which is important for certain apps, and for being able to use over 4GB of ram, which many people are starting to need in engineering and graphic design.

Im not quite sure the differences between intel and amd, they both have to conform to the x86 standard, so in that sense they are very similar. Although the way that the pentium 4 and the athlon do computations are slightly different. The differences are not that great, but for one thing, the pentium4 has a very long pipeline which means that it takes longer for any one thing to happen, but that they can crank up the clock speed like the bejesus, while amd has shorter and wider pipelines so they can do more per clock cycle, this is why amd is pushing their comparisons between amd chips and intel, such as the 2000+XP, saying that it is equivilent to a 2GHz pentium4.

PPC chips, made by IBM and motorola are used in IBMs blade servers and their R/S6000 series computers as well as some of their mainframes I believe.

If you want more info, intel has lots of stuff on their site, you just have to find it, while if you want info on sun stuff, have fun. Sun's site is almost impossible to find anything on :roll:

If I have confused you more than you were before, let me know and I will try to clear up my self.

-Andrew


Hi , thanks for providing this information to me , with a clear exlpaination . I think my next personal computer wil be a PowerPc or sparc.

regards
pantoffel
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
squanto
Guru
Guru


Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 524
Location: Rochester, NY, USA

PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2003 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pantoffel wrote:
I think my next personal computer wil be a PowerPc or sparc.

One thing to considder though is not just the cpu, but also memory architechure(sp?). On the current PPC boards that you can actually purhcase (which come from apple right now) they are not using the DDR ram to its fullest potential as I last knew. Whereas the P4 and Athlons utilize it much better. Also, for price / performance ratio, the x86 market has a much better offering, mainly AMD though.

If you get a sparc, I hope you have lots of money, they are quite expensive.

If you decide to go with an Apple product, thats cool. I used to be a "Mac Guy" and own the original G4, but now due to $$ I have an AMD box and will probably stick with AMD for a while in building machines. A dual AMD box will run a similar price to a single processor Apple box and possibly a few grand less than a comprible sun machine.

Granted that the x86 isn't as good as a RISC chip, but Intel and AMD have found ways to keep pace or surpase the consumer RISC chips by upping the clock speeds to incredible values and because they are mass produced in HUGE quantities, they are reletively inexpensive.

Glad to give help! :D

-Andrew
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
squanto
Guru
Guru


Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 524
Location: Rochester, NY, USA

PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2003 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually.... (now that I think about it some...) My examples of how x86 code can be long probably weren't the best picked ones... but it was the idea that counts ;) :lol:
Either way, I think I got what I was trying to say across....

-Andrew
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Off the Wall All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum